On MSNBC, State Rep. Zephyr, State Rep. Jones, and U.S. Rep. Frost discuss anti-democracy efforts across the country
Frost: “The right-wing understands that time is not on their side, that this incoming generation of voters is voting for Democrats and people who are gonna fight for them, and so they're clinching onto that power”
Published
Citation From the April 26, 2023, edition of MSNBC's The Last Word with Lawrence O'Donnell
ALI VELSHI (HOST): Joining us now is the Democratic State Representative Zooey Zephyr of Montana, Democratic U.S Congressman Maxwell Frost of Florida, and Democratic state Representative Justin Jones of Tennessee. I'm honored to have you all here, thank you for being with us. Representative Zephyr, let me please start with you. Your speeches, including your speech today, you have taken what they accused you of doing, breaching decorum, and you have put that up against death, literally. You have said that what these laws do, is that they can end up in people’s deaths — whether it's suicides, because people live in a society that others them, and tells and that they not welcome, they're scary, and they're a threat or because this entrenches hate against trans people.
ZOOEY ZEPHYR (MONTANA STATE REPRESENTATIVE): That's exactly right, I gave the example of the suicide in my speech, but we’ve also had people attacked and public, run over by vehicles in Montana. The violence is escalating, and these policies create the conditions of that violence in our state, and the legislators that are trying to pass them, when people stand up in defense of our communities, they’re not okay with just passing it, they want to silence us.
VELSHI: Representative Jones, thank you and welcome to the show. Something that you said stuck with me, you said if you come for one of us, you come for all of us. You know, that wasn’t clear a few weeks ago when you were kicked out of the Tennessee legislature, that that was gonna be the case. And what we saw was a whole bunch of people who don't know anything about Tennessee, or the Tennessee legislature, or you, signing up and saying, not only do I want to help this cause but I want to get into the cause.
JUSTIN JONES (TENNESSEE STATE REPRESENTATIVE): Definitely, what we're seeing, and what we warned about in Tennessee, was that if it went forward in Tennessee, this attempt to silence dissent with the most extreme measures, it would set a precedent. So we knew if they came from one of us, they would come for others of us. And as we saw today with Representative Zephyr in Montana, this trend toward authoritarianism is just continuing. But also when I say when they come for one of us they come for all of us, that means that we’re gonna stand together in solidarity as a multiracial, multigenerational movement. To say that we will not allow fascism to happen without a challenge. That we care more about democracy than we do about decorum, we care more about the deaths of these young people than about this false decorum that’s used to silent dissent and oppress voices that are challenging their dominant narrative of injustice. So we must stand together, we stand with you Representative Zephyr in whatever we can do to support, let you know we are standing in solidarity from Tennessee because we know this is a very dangerous trend toward a road we don't go down.
VELSHI: Representative Zephyr, how does that make you feel?
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ZEPHYR: I feel solidarity, what else could feel? We know in this moment, trans people are the target de jour for the far-right, with over 400 bills targeting the community across state legislatures this year. But I know also in Montana, the first people standing up for me were the American Indian caucus, pointing out that our state has a long history of targeting marginalized communities with policies that lead to separation and death. And so we know that if we’re going to succeed in this, one community is not enough to shift the tides of history here. We need all of us standing here and fighting together.
VELSHI: Congressman Frost, I'm more than twice the age of all of you. It is kind of interesting because Representative Jones says this is multigenerational and it's multiracial. It does seem to be a lot of young people leading it. Is it multigenerational? Can you get the rest of us, who are not as creative, to get on this bandwagon, and say it's going to look different in the future, it's going to change? Representative Ocasio-Cortez says it's darkest before the dawn. Do you believe that to be true and can you get the rest of us to sign on to it?
MAXWELL FROST (FLORIDA CONGRESSMAN): I do believe it to be true, and I believe to be true because when we go to these actions, when we're out on the streets, we’re protesting for our rights, the rights of our neighbors, the trans community, the LGBTQ+ community, Black folks, immigrants, poor people in this country, it's young people but it's all generations coming together. And what we know and we heard this time and time again at a press conference earlier today, is we stand on the shoulders of giants and elders who've come before us. And you know I’ve heard many many times — I'm sure Representative Zephyr and Jones have heard this too — the young people will save us. And here's the thing, it shouldn’t have to be up to the young people to save us, we need everybody working together, multiracial, multigenerational, coming together to fight for the world we deserve. That's how we build an America that's true to its promise, and an America that's true to its promise rejects fascism and embraces democracy. A democracy where somebody like Representative Zephyr can stand up for their constituents, for her constituents that deserve to have that representation. But what we see happening is that the right-wing understands that time is not on their side, that this incoming generation of voters is voting for Democrats and people who are gonna fight for them, and so they're clinching onto that power with everything that they can do. That's why we are seeing this rise in right-wing fascism across the country, but we're gonna fight it and we’re gonna win.
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JONES: I mean that is what gives me hope, is that if you look at what they did, it's that their attacks on Democracy that are galvanizing a movement, they have lost a generation. And the truth be told, you know in the south we have a saying: a dying mule kicks hardest. These systems of white supremacy, these systems of transphobia, of homophobia, of plantation politics are dying, and so that's why we're seeing this extreme reaction, because they know that we — look at the screen right now, this represents the future of America. This represents the vision of America that they're so fearful of, because it's an inclusive America, it's one that affirms human dignity, it's one that affirms our solidarity with each other and our connection. But let them be on notice that this is just the beginning. We're gonna continue to push forward towards that vision of America that lives up to what it says on paper, towards that vision of America that challenges this notion people like us don't belong in elected office. Because we're not going in there to make friends, we're going to know to make change and that's the difference. We are not gonna assimilate, we're not gonna conform to a system that's been meant to make us feel small and to stifle our voices and the voices of our constituents. We’re going with this bold manner to say that we have to push forward together and that these systems, their time has come and that a new generation is rising up to make America what it ought to be.
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VELSHI: What a remarkable conversation, thanks to all three of you for being here, and thanks for doing what you do for democracy. Representative Zooey Zephyr, Tennessee Representative Justin Jones, Florida Congressman Maxwell Frost, we appreciate you all being with us tonight.