JOE SCARBOROUGH (CO-HOST): Let's talk about the COVID relief bill. Larry Summers has written an op-ed a lot of people have talked about. He's concerned about inflation, possible inflationary concerns. I've talked to other Democratic economists who also are not voicing those concerns publicly but also share some concerns. I know you have always -- you have certainly over the past 20 years said that more is better, not to be concerned about deficits and debt right now.
PAUL KRUGMAN (NEW YORK TIMES COLUMNIST): Right.
SCARBOROUGH: Not to be concerned about inflationary pressures. Is that where you stand still with this $1.9 trillion COVID relief bill?
KRUGMAN: It's a big bill. It's a bill that is big enough that I'm comfortable that it's doing enough, and that's telling you that it's bigger than we normally get and -- look, there were some people -- there is a case that it's a bit, it's a bit richer than we need. But, and I always take Larry very seriously, and other people, Olivier Blanchard, who I take seriously, are concerned that it's too big. On the other hand Goldman Sachs -- whatever you think of their other activities, they have a terrific team of economists, they think it's fine, Bank of America think it's fine, the International Monetary Fund thinks it's fine. If there's one thing we really learned from the Obama years is that the risks of doing too little are much bigger than the risks of doing too much.